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СпутникиРНSpaceXРоскосмосNASAfantasy-anatomy-analyst:anremithrl:paissiges:anremithrl:paissiges:anremithrl:Can a cat’s purring be expressed in the IPA? What kind of international alphabet fails to account for cats!?i’m going to take this post way too seriously.cat purring is just ultra low-frequency laryngeal oscillations, or, in more typical linguistics terminology, ultra low-tone modal voicing. so if a cat was purring on the exhale through her nose with her lips closed (assuming no closure further back in the vocal tract) you could approximate it as [m̩̏ː] (if those diacritics don’t show up, that’s a long extra low-tone syllabic m). although if you wanted to treat the purring itself as the primary manner of articulation rather than as simple voicing, you would need a symbol for a glottal trill. that doesn’t exist in the IPA, but you could approximate it by adding the “retracted” diacritic to the symbol for the epiglottal trill, so something like [ʜ̠̩ː] (long syllabic retracted voiceless epiglottal trill), potential nasal coarticulation omitted. and then if you wanted to represent purring on the inhale, you would have to add the “ingressive airstream” symbol (↓) to your representation of choice.bird vocalizations, on the other hand, are way beyond anything the IPA can capture.1. Never, ever, ever be afraid to take a post to seriously because however flippantly I word it my post is serious. Thank you so much this answered my question.2.Thank you thank you thank you. I have only very introductory linguistics knowledge. I took only the upper division intro course in undergrad and wanted to take more but was always too busy taking math courses and the schedule never worked out. So forgive me if I’m horribly wrong, but would I just write, like:[m̩̏ːːːːːːː]Or… how? Not that there are any situations I can think of where I need to write that out.3. Why are bird vocalisations so far beyond what IPA can capture? Why do you know this?ok yay!cats often purr continuously while breathing in and out, so maybe something like [m̩̏ːːːːː ↓m̩̏ːːːːː m̩̏ːːːːː ↓m̩̏ːːːːː m̩̏ːːːːː ↓m̩̏ːːːːː] with alternating ingressive and egressive airstreams?because birds have something called the syrinx which they use for phonation instead of their larynx (which birds do have but don’t use for phonation). they syrinx is anatomically very different from the larynx (although phonation works similarly for both organs). it consists of multiple membranous walls that sit between rings of cartilage and vibrate when air passes by them (kind of hard to describe, it’s probably better to just look up a diagram). it’s also located where the trachea splits to go to the lungs which allows birds to phonate with the left and right branches simultaneously (potentially making sounds of different pitches with each). so basically you would need to extend the IPA to be able to represent “syringeal” phonation and somehow account for the possibility of “double phonation”. as to why i know this, it’s because i’m super interested in communication among nonhuman animals and to what extent it’s comparable to human language!it’s kind of funny, i’m basically in the opposite position to you. i always wanted to take more math classes but i’m too busy with linguistics.Revisiting this because it’s awesome.Cool stuff to consider if you’re into making conlangs and you want to have fun with non-human people having their own phonemes. Alas I am not knowledgeable enough about linguistics to offer much of my own advice here, but I will say that I’ve had my own fun just limiting the sounds that might exist in the languages of some of my people species. Orcs and birdfolk, for example, might struggle with typical bilabial consonants and therefore avoid them entirely. I haven’t fully figured out if my froggish goblins would be able to differentiate between L and R, or how exactly the back-folding and extra soft frog-like tongue would limit their consonants, but i also figure they could make a lot of unique consonant and vowel sounds through the air sac in their throats.
Can a cat's purring be expressed in the IPA? What kind of international alphabet fails to account for cats!?
i'm going to take this post way too seriously.
cat purring is just ultra low-frequency laryngeal oscillations, or, in more typical linguistics terminology, ultra low-tone modal voicing. so if a cat was purring on the exhale through her nose with her lips closed (assuming no closure further back in the vocal tract) you could approximate it as [m̩̏ː] (if those diacritics don't show up, that's a long extra low-tone syllabic m). although if you wanted to treat the purring itself as the primary manner of articulation rather than as simple voicing, you would need a symbol for a glottal trill. that doesn't exist in the IPA, but you could approximate it by adding the "retracted" diacritic to the symbol for the epiglottal trill, so something like [ʜ̠̩ː] (long syllabic retracted voiceless epiglottal trill), potential nasal coarticulation omitted. and then if you wanted to represent purring on the inhale, you would have to add the "ingressive airstream" symbol (↓) to your representation of choice.
bird vocalizations, on the other hand, are way beyond anything the IPA can capture.
1.
Never, ever, ever be afraid to take a post to seriously because however flippantly I word it my post is serious. Thank you so much this answered my question.
2.
Thank you thank you thank you. I have only very introductory linguistics knowledge. I took only the upper division intro course in undergrad and wanted to take more but was always too busy taking math courses and the schedule never worked out. So forgive me if I'm horribly wrong, but would I just write, like:
[m̩̏ːːːːːːː]
Or... how?
Not that there are any situations I can think of where I need to write that out.
3. Why are bird vocalisations so far beyond what IPA can capture? Why do you know this?
it's kind of funny, i'm basically in the opposite position to you. i always wanted to take more math classes but i'm too busy with linguistics.
Cool stuff to consider if you're into making conlangs and you want to have fun with non-human people having their own phonemes.
Alas I am not knowledgeable enough about linguistics to offer much of my own advice here, but I will say that I've had my own fun just limiting the sounds that might exist in the languages of some of my people species. Orcs and birdfolk, for example, might struggle with typical bilabial consonants and therefore avoid them entirely.
I haven't fully figured out if my froggish goblins would be able to differentiate between L and R, or how exactly the back-folding and extra soft frog-like tongue would limit their consonants, but i also figure they could make a lot of unique consonant and vowel sounds through the air sac in their throats.